By-Tor.com

awip2062 wrote:Three things off the top of my head:

--Taken the sovereignty of nations away from the nations.

--Made themselves popular.

--Gotten press coverage.

And confiscated a lot of dough from the U.S.

New headline:

WASHINGTON - If Hillary Rodham Clinton wins the presidency, some top Democrats would like to see her husband, former President Bill Clinton, appointed to serve out Hillary?s unexpired Senate term.

Have we now turned into England and the Clintons are the royal family?

The separation of Science and State?

Many people put their faith in science the way others put their faith in a being. Science, as religion, explains origins, defines our purpose or lack of it, sets morals...

Check out the picture that was mistakenly put up alongside an article about the House of Reps:

http://www.boingboing.net/2007/02/16/ny ... _rock.html

I love these four headlines today

Strongest snowstorm in half century buries China...

February was coldest in 28 years For Toronto...

Record Low Temps In New York City...

Brothel Owners Blame Global Warming for Staff Shortages...

Libby found guilty

Former White House aide I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby has been found guilty on four of five counts in his perjury and obstruction of justice trial. CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin said, "He is virtually certain to go to prison if this conviction is upheld."

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Maybe, but he will most likely get a presidential pardon, wot?

Big Blue Owl wrote:Libby found guilty

Former White House aide I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby has been found guilty on four of five counts in his perjury and obstruction of justice trial. CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin said, "He is virtually certain to go to prison if this conviction is upheld."

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Maybe, but he will most likely get a presidential pardon, wot?

There is SO much to say about this trial... but my first thought is, "And Sandy Berger goes free?!!!"

You bet your ass he does

Big Blue Owl wrote:You bet your ass he does

So, can anyone tell me... what was this case about? What crime was committed?

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A federal jury Tuesday found I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, former aide to Vice President Dick Cheney, guilty on four of five counts in his perjury and obstruction of justice trial.

Libby was convicted of:

# obstruction of justice when he intentionally deceived a grand jury investigating the outing of CIA operative Valerie Plame;

# making a false statement by intentionally lying to FBI agents about a conversation with NBC newsman Tim Russert;

# perjury when he lied in court about his conversation with Russert;

# a second count of perjury when he lied in court about conversations with other reporters.

Jurors, who deliberated for 10 days, cleared Libby of a second count of making a false statement relating to a conversation he had with writer Matt Cooper, formerly of Time magazine.

Interesting how one of the jurors, after the verdict, told the media that the jury felt sorry for him, and that they knew he was a "fall guy" who otherwise shouldn't be tried. They were wondering why he was being tried, yet they managed to find him guilty.

Hmmmmmmmm

Big Blue Owl wrote:WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A federal jury Tuesday found I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, former aide to Vice President Dick Cheney, guilty on four of five counts in his perjury and obstruction of justice trial.

Libby was convicted of:

# obstruction of justice when he intentionally deceived a grand jury investigating the outing of CIA operative Valerie Plame;

Now, in regards to that...

1. Richard Armitage confessed to the "outing" of Plame. He is no friend of the Bush administration, and certainly wasn't acting on the orders of the vice president. With that revelation, why was Fitzgerald continuing to investigate the vice-president's office?

2. Though the "outing" of Plame was what launched this investigation, no one has ever been charged with it, even though someone confessed to it.

3. It has not even been established whether or not a crime was committed when Plame was "outed". The judge in this case told the jury as much.

So... what was this trial for again?

Lying under oath, if you boil it down to the bare elements.

I'm with the jurors in that, although they believe he was guilty of lying to FBI, Grand Jury, and so on, he was lying to cover for others. They mentioned, "Where is Rove", etc.

He is definitely being used as a fall guy.

Big Blue Owl wrote:Lying under oath, if you boil it down to the bare elements.

I'm with the jurors in that, although they believe he was guilty of lying to FBI, Grand Jury, and so on, he was lying to cover for others. They mentioned, "Where is Rove", etc.

He is definitely being used as a fall guy.

See, there's a big problem. "Where is Rove?" He had nothing to do with it. We have someone else who has confessed to the whole thing. There was nothing to cover up.

Let's say there's a car stolen in BBO's neighborhood. An investigation is launched. BBO is considered a suspect among others. He is questioned, along with others. Some of his answers seem contradictory, so they bring him back for more questioning. But then, during all this, the real car theif is caught. Actually, he comes in and confesses. But in spite of that, they charge BBO with lying to investigators and put him on trial. And THEN find him guilty! Even though he had nothing whatsoever to do with the car theft. Do you not see a problem with this picture?